How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Non-categorized watch related discussion
Post Reply
User avatar
GeorgeH
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:10 am

How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by GeorgeH » Thu May 16, 2019 10:39 pm

I got to thinking about converting my current modest watch collection of 19 pieces to all "Swiss Made" (with the exception of G-Shocks). Does this idea make any sense or is it just a dumb idea? I would have to do a lot of flipping over time as I only have 2 watches that say "Swiss Made" on the dial at the 6 o'clock position...a Steinhart GMT Ocean 1 and a recently acquired Edox Chronorally S quartz. Would my collection be of better quality and possibly hold its value better? My watch budget would be limited, like sub $500 watches. Off the top of my head I would be looking at Brands like Alpina, Hamilton, Tissot, Edox, and I'm sure there are others. I don't mind quartz, especially for chronographs.
I would welcome any and all suggestions. Below is what I think is the latest law describing "Swiss Made" watches.

"The main change introduced by the strengthening of the label consists in specifying a minimum value criterion for the watch, as opposed to the movement only. To be marked Swiss made, a watch has to meet the requirement of minimum 60% of Swiss value.

Previous requirements, such as the incorporation of a Swiss movement, casing-up and final inspection in Switzerland, remain in place. However, the definition of the Swiss movement adopts a minimum rate of Swiss value of 60% (as opposed to the previous 50%).

New criteria are added to the calculation of Swiss value, such as research and development and certification costs.

The new Swiss made ordinance entered into force on January 1st, 2017."
GeorgeH
"Buy what you like and can afford"
User avatar
Budman2k
Posts: 116
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:22 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by Budman2k » Fri May 17, 2019 5:15 am

I'm not a Swiss "snob" by any means; I own some Japanese movement watches and even a few "unknowns" :). But I do prefer Swiss Made if possible. Some of the brands you mentioned have great offerings in the price range you're looking at. You can add Oris and Fredrique Constant to the list and I'm sure some others will chime in.
User avatar
Mark
Posts: 159
Joined: Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:37 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by Mark » Fri May 17, 2019 7:50 am

Nothing wrong with Swiss Made, or German, or Japanese. At your price point, I would say that there are at least as many good Japanese products available as there are Swiss. To me, the holding value proposition depends more on the manufacturer and model than where it is made. There are a few G shock models, for example, which demand crazy prices as far as I am concerned.
User avatar
GeorgeH
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:10 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by GeorgeH » Sat May 18, 2019 11:08 pm

Thanks to those who posted. I read them all and came to the following conclusion. I plan to "remodel" my current watch collection so that 60% of the total value of the collection will be "Swiss Made". Thus, I will be following the rule "To be marked Swiss made, a watch has to meet the requirement of minimum 60% of Swiss value." So I will have a Swiss Made collection, but not all will be Swiss made. So I can keep my 6 G-Shocks, Seiko Turtle and a Deep Blue. The Invictas, Orients and Citizen will have to go. I will be looking at Edox, Alpina and Tissot and maybe some others. I have owned Tissot in the past but not Edox, until recently and never had an Alpina. Edox is an intersting company...not owned by the big 4. So it will give me a fun project to work on. I have already started by buying a Luminox Navy Seal 3500 Series....got to have some tritium tubes. Luminox is an American company but Swiss Made.
GeorgeH
"Buy what you like and can afford"
User avatar
svaglic
Posts: 859
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:00 pm

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by svaglic » Mon May 20, 2019 9:14 am

I like variety, I have a little of almost everything. I have met most of my goals of a nice Chinese watch= Madison Celedon, German watch=Rundenmeister, French watch I don’t have yet, but will likely be a Yema, Japan watch=Seiko, Russian Watch=An old Vostok, Korean watch=Tisell etc... I have a lot of Swiss made and the quality does seem better, it’s not difficult to see it either.
I also have a small wrist, so I buy divers where I can find them at 40mm or below. With a small wrist, I can’t afford to be choosy most of the time.
I like variety though and have some I can wear in most weather conditions and some I wouldn’t.
I also rarely pay too much money for a watch. I scour watchrecon for like new used watches until I find a bargain or I buy at awesome sale prices if new.
I’ve been lucky in finding what I like at good prices so If I were to sell my watches, I believe I would break even or a little ahead. My vintage watches help in that area, they usually only go up in value. Most others were such good deals that any loss would be minimal, I monitor resale values and haven’t been sick by what I’ve seen.
It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.
watcheronthewall
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 7:19 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by watcheronthewall » Fri May 24, 2019 1:28 pm

SKILL (Olivier Mory, La Chaux-de-Fonds) wants to come up with a new taxonomy. He thinks the 60% Swiss-made requirement is deceptive (regulations stipulate 60% to claim the title). So, he builds 100% Swiss-made watches. He even does his own in-house tourbillon movement.

IMO it's not about whether Swiss made is better or not, it's about transparency. I like that about Olivier.
User avatar
temerityb
Posts: 169
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:00 pm

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by temerityb » Mon May 27, 2019 8:59 am

watcheronthewall wrote:SKILL (Olivier Mory, La Chaux-de-Fonds) wants to come up with a new taxonomy. He thinks the 60% Swiss-made requirement is deceptive (regulations stipulate 60% to claim the title). So, he builds 100% Swiss-made watches. He even does his own in-house tourbillon movement.

IMO it's not about whether Swiss made is better or not, it's about transparency. I like that about Olivier.


H. Moser is so pissed off about companies that aren't 100 percent Swiss-made being allowed to use the term on their dials that Moser has taken the term Swiss Made off their dials ... when their own products are fully Swiss Made. Moser's got attitude, and their watches are incredible.
"Feels like home ...Feels like I'm on my way back to where I belong"
- Randy Newman
Bovas
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon May 27, 2019 3:32 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by Bovas » Wed May 29, 2019 6:27 am

I really like "Swiss made" but I'd never limit my collection just those. I actually have a "pure" Swiss made collection at the moment but only by chance and because I only have 3 watches at the moment. Looking to expand soon, of course. haha
Hawk
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:48 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by Hawk » Wed May 29, 2019 4:33 pm

Nothing wrong with going "Swiss Made" at all but Moser has a good point and the "percentage of value" criteria carries with it a mathematical irony. Specifically, the lower the cost of ancillary parts the easier it is to hit "60% of value".

Using random guesswork, If the case was German, the dial French etc. a Swiss movement combined with Swiss casing labor might have hit, say, 50% of total value. Change the case, dial and hands to Hong Kong and the relative value of the Swiss movement and labor spikes to something well north of 60%. Simply because the value of the non-Swiss portion has plummeted without making the end product one whit better and arguably "cheaper" overall. One thing the Swiss are really, really bad at is writing a standard that can't be gamed.

And A. Lange, Grand Seiko and Credor have taken a lot of the "gotta be Swiss" starch out of the old arguments.

Somebody has to have a smidgin of nerve to price something higher than GS's upper range and slapping "Swiss" on the dial doesn't do it for me. Some Swiss product certainly but not any and everything capable of legally stating "Swiss Made".
User avatar
GeorgeH
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:10 am

Re: How desirable is it to have "Swiss Made" watches

Post by GeorgeH » Wed May 29, 2019 11:52 pm

Lots of interesting replies! My idea behind going with a collection that is 60% in value "Swiss Made" is sort of an experiment to test the 60% rule and still have 40% non Swiss Made in the collection.
But rather than debate whether a watch is 60%, 80% or 100% Swiss Made I am interested in my on-the-wrist experience with the watches and also can I get a good deal when I buy them and do they hold their value if I decide to flip. I also enjoy hearing what other collectors have to say about their "on-the-wrist" experiences and resale value.
There are also some great watches made in Germany. I can remember owning a couple of SINN watches. One was a U1 diver which I bought for $1200 in 2006 and now they are over $2000. The case was made out of submarine steel...awesome!!
GeorgeH
"Buy what you like and can afford"
Post Reply