Old 07-12-2010, 09:36 AM
Glass Half Glass Half is offline
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Default "Gold tone" durability?
Over at Blue Dial, there are quite a few Seikos and other brands between $100-$150, sale price.

Watches that are gold are described as "gold tone:"

http://www.bluedial.com/snke56.htm

The term brings back memories of gold-colored costume jewelry at Target. The color wore off after awhile, revealing a silver color underneath.

How durable is the gold tone material on watches?

Thanks
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Old 07-12-2010, 10:07 AM
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Artemisia1 Artemisia1 is offline
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I have a gold tone Seiko that has had not fading problems - but I have a strap on it, so the gold tone face is all there is and it doesn't contact oily, possibly sweaty skin nor does it deal appreciably with friction from daily wear. However; the bracelet on my Invicta does have some real fading problems in areas; particularly near the clasp.

The one you linked to is a Seiko 5 for $120.00. Check Watchdoddy.com for Daily Deals sites that have the Seiko 5 on sale. You can almost always find one or two different Seiko 5's on sale for between $55.00-$75.00.

Put a strap on the Seiko and I doubt you'll ever encounter any problems.
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Old 07-12-2010, 10:26 AM
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Default How does the gold come onto the watch case?
How does the gold come onto the watch case?


In some countries like India as well as in many Latin American markets gold coloured watches are commonly found. In Europe and the US gold coloured watches have gone out of fashion somewhat.

Gold is a soft metal which is not very suitable to making a watch case of. However, by adding other metals like copper to it becomes harder and some special watches have made their cases out of gold.

On all other 'gold watches' there is a coating applied to the watch case.

Basically there are a few different procedures used in the watch industry to apply these coats. These are:

Gold plating

Goldfilling

Electro plating

PVD coating


Let's take a look at these technologies in more detail.


Gold plating
In this chemical process a coat of genuine gold is applied onto the case. Bonding gold to brass and silver cases yields the best results. The copper and silver atoms let the gold coat diffuse nicely into them. Copper is rather inexpensive and it is used to make brass. That is why in not a too distant past many gold plated watches had cases made of brass. However, most watch cases today are made of stainless steel 314L.

The coat's thickness is expressed in microns. A micron measures one thousandth of a millimetre or one millionth of a metre. The thickness of the coat is routinely between 3 to 5 microns only. As genuine gold is used in the process the thickness of the coat has a direct impact on the price of the watch.

The drawback of gold plating is that the soldering of lugs and other treatments are very difficult. The coat comes off or it is slightly tarnished. This limits the choice of shapes of the watches.

As the watch is coated only superficially, the coat is bound to come off over time. Depending on your diet it can come off within a few years. How? By eating spicy food and living in a hot climate for instance your sweat's chemistry becomes very aggressive and the coat is 'eaten alive'. That is why most gold plated watches have heavy-set stainless steel bottoms 'lifting' the watch off from your skin as far as possible.

Gold plating is a fairly basic process and well proven at that.



Goldfilled aka Gold overlay
Goldfilled watches undergo basically the same procedure as gold plated ones. However, the thickness of the coat is greater and it is therefore expressed in carats and not in microns.

Goldfilling was used by many Swiss manufacturers in the 1950s through to the early 1980s.

Due to the much thicker coat (9 - 14 carats) it resists wear and tear a lot better and the watch looks shiny and bright many years longer than with gold plating. And the soldering of lugs for instance is easier as well as the coat is thicker.

Obviously as more gold is used the coating is costlier. Therefore it is used for higher range products only.


Gold plating and Goldfilling are nowadays often done in a gold bath. The items to be plated are put on racks and immersed in the solution. By getting the racks to micro-vibrate the coating experts ensure a perfectly even coat. The result is a very glossy tone of 18 carat gold.



Electro Plating
Electro Plating sometimes referred to as IP plating or GEP plating is a step further from the immersion plating.

In the electro plating process the watch cases are placed into the solution and electricity is chased through the bath. The coat of gold is thereby attached better to the case. It goes off less readily.

However it is still a plating process.



PVD coating
This is the high echelon of surface protection. PVD stands for Physical Vaporized Deposition. The goal of the PVD process is to enmesh the 'gold' completely with the watch case's material.

Here the thoroughly cleaned watch cases are placed in a high-temperature oven. Then the air is sucked out of the oven in order to create a very tight vacuum. Once this state has been achieved a process gas most often argon is pumped into the oven's chamber and the cases are then heated.

Into the chamber with the heated up watch cases Zirconium is sprayed and the whole chamber's contents get jolted by electricity. The Zirconium then reacts with the heated cases and is completely enmeshed into the metal. It bonds totally to the watch cases and will never come off again. The case is resistant to scratches and the onslaught of most aggressive chemicals. Remember the spicy food mentionned earlier?

PVD has been in use for quite some time in the sanitary industry and in the door hardware industry. Only faily recently it has been used in higher volumes in the watch industry.

The beauty of PVD is that you can do nearly every colour and hue and that it stays that way for nearly forever. On top of that you do not have to use genuine gold but Zirconium only. This makes it much more affordable too. The drawback is the high investment into the equipment.



Because of the way watches live with us I favour PVD over all other methods. I want our customers to enjoy their gold coloured watches as long as possible. And in my humble opinion if it is not solid gold it better had be PVD.
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Old 07-12-2010, 07:30 PM
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James

You did not mention Invicta's Gold Swiss Layering that bonds at the molecular level and will not rub off.
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:02 PM
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James, your knowledge is again such a great addition to this site. Thanks for being a member and commenting on such things, you really make me feel smarter after reading every comment you post.
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMMVMMM View Post
James, your knowledge is again such a great addition to this site. Thanks for being a member and commenting on such things, you really make me feel smarter after reading every comment you post.
My thoughts exactly. I truly value your posts.

Best of Luck,

TA
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:28 PM
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Another James' masterpiece ... we are all the better for it.

kudo's James..
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:40 PM
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Two brands that plate more than 5 microns are Hamilton (10 microns) and TAG heuer (20 microns).

Consider the price of the watch when determining if the plating will last. My wife had a $100 Seiko that tarnished in just a few months. More expensive ones surely would last longer.
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Old 07-12-2010, 09:48 PM
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Thanks again, James for your knowledge in every facet of the watch

industry and production information...

I own an Officina Del Tempo chrono that has the PVD gold finish and its as new as the day I bought it...I would think this finishing process would be more prevalent in the watch industry...

Deck
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Old 07-12-2010, 10:18 PM
Glass Half Glass Half is offline
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James, thank you for taking the time to share valuable info. I'll copy it for my files.

Artemisia, thanks for the tip on a better price and to everyone else for your good observations.

So perhaps the Seiko folks will let me know which process they use on this particular model. We'll see. Regardless, maybe putting a different strap on will delay any wear.

Too bad the color gold is out of fashion. Silver makes my skin look ghastly, although black's fine.

James, thanks again.
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Old 07-13-2010, 05:36 PM
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Thanks, James, for your encyclopedic-knowledge of all things horological!
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Old 07-13-2010, 05:48 PM
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I too found this fascinating. But I was also looking for an explanation of Swiss Gold Layering used by Invicta. I've always wondered what the technique is really called.
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Old 07-14-2010, 03:45 AM
Glass Half Glass Half is offline
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James, your excellent tutorial has been valuable already. Below, JAS1125 posted a hot deal for a $69.95 Pulsar.

Right away, I saw "Rose Gold PVD case" in the description, knew it was top-notch, and ordered quickly. (Hope I understood you correctly. If not, back to the books for this WIS.)

Thank you again, Glass Half


Quote:
Originally Posted by JAS1125 View Post
Great price....someone posted a mini-review about this not too long ago if memory serves.




http://awatchforyou.com/Default.aspx


This is a brand-new men's Pulsar PUA120 Tech Gear diver's watch.
It is brand-new in the original Pulsar box with papers.
The MSRP is $299.95.

Precision Japan-made Solar-Powered Quartz Movement
200 meters water resistant
Mineral Crystal
44 mm case
15mm case thickness
Unidirectional Rotating Bezel
Date Window
Black adjustable Urethane Strap fits a wrist 8.5 inches
Rose Gold PVD case
Luminous Hands and hour markers
Ships for only $5 in the US!

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Old 07-14-2010, 06:31 AM
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Dear Boscoe,

Swiss Gold Layer is just giving immersion plating a fancier name.

There is no special procedure in plating that we follow here in Switzerland that would warrant to be given its own name.

I am mesmerized by the terms these marketing folks come up with all the time. If employees were allowed to put as much dilligence in their manufacturing processes as in marketing the world would be a much nicer and safer place, in my humble opinion.

I am recommending to stay away from any plating below 10 microns, by the way.
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Old 07-14-2010, 03:54 PM
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Thanks, for all the Great Information!!!

I for one will be a better consumer now in regards to gold plating with your insight.

I remember the term goldfilled from Cross Pens.
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#1

PDF for your files